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Power Rankings.

Re: Power Rankings.

Postby Shgon Dunstan » Mon Nov 25, 2013 2:23 pm

MEK1724 wrote:The second part contained no real analysis of why a kid knowing how to do something implied that an adult could do something at all. Also it stated that we see dispelling rarely , without defining or demonstrating that we see it rarely .
As far as I know dispelling is seen quite frequently with mana balls among warriors . Only Maya a slave , and that commoner mob failed to do it .(also we didn't see all of the mob . some of them could have been dispelling the projectiles for all we know)


None of which is a reason to just pretend I didn't make the second part, rather then just directing those completes at it. *wutno*

It's rather blatant a kid knowing how to do a learned skill, rather then something you need a talent for to do in the first place, implies that an adult should be able to do it. They've had a lot longer time in which to learn it, a bloody lot longer in a lot of cases in this manga.

As for "demonstrating that we see it rarely"... I had kind of assumed you hade read the manga. *ooo*

And if it's seen so frequently among warriors, I guess you'll have no problem finding examples.

I don't quite know what you mean by "mana" . I mean we see what could be Ariel doing what I assume is dispelling fire , here.


...Or you know, just using her Wind affinity. ^^;

And we see a child destroy a floating device extremely easily here .


...That's not even close to the same thing. *hmmm*
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Re: Power Rankings.

Postby H'K'Maly » Mon Nov 25, 2013 10:40 pm

Shgon Dunstan wrote:
Dalvyserran wrote:What quain does is not absorption, it's dispelling. Anyone with training can dispel, such as chrystel dispelling Ariel's mana bolts http://www.drowtales.com/mainarchive.php?sid=4872. Quain does the same thing with Syphille's mana bolts http://www.drowtales.com/mainarchive.php?sid=5972

but this is getting way off topic. this is a discussion of power rankings, not mana abilities. ^^;

Personally, the fact that chrystel, a kid, could do it, is the biggest problem with the "it's just a learned skill" idea. *hmmm*

I mean... If a kid can do it, why do we see it so rarely? *ooo*


Did noone though about that bit that just because Chrystel was able to dispel Ariel's mana bolts it doesn't mean she would be able to do the same to Sill'ice (to name someone she actually fought with)?
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Re: Power Rankings.

Postby Shgon Dunstan » Tue Nov 26, 2013 2:19 am

H'K'Maly wrote:
Did noone though about that bit that just because Chrystel was able to dispel Ariel's mana bolts it doesn't mean she would be able to do the same to Sill'ice (to name someone she actually fought with)?

Perfectly plausible, even likely, only... Not something we should have to guess about by chapter 44. *wutno*
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Re: Power Rankings.

Postby MEK1724 » Tue Nov 26, 2013 1:27 pm

Shgon Dunstan wrote:It's rather blatant a kid knowing how to do a learned skill, rather then something you need a talent for to do in the first place, implies that an adult should be able to do it.

All else equal yes . However all of those children had opportunity to spend years practising said skill you mention . If a commoner would need similar levels of time and training to pull it off effectively , this may well be out of their price range (time spent learning , is time spent not earning money , which obviously gives it a fairly hefty cost compared to not spending time learning to do it) . Unless you are arguing that it is something which they would learn as children , like say how walking is , (with no evidence as far as I can see ,supporting this) this is a sufficient explanation for why they can't do it .
For example many people have no idea how to shoot guns accurately , however children can learn how to do it , and surpass most adults with no training .
Even given that they can , does not imply that anyone will .
As for "demonstrating that we see it rarely"... I had kind of assumed you hade read the manga. *ooo*

I have . A demonstration of your case would be , someone who had no reason not to dispell a deadly projectile flung at them failing to doing so and being injured or killed . (for example Maya)
Shgon Dunstan wrote:And if it's seen so frequently among warriors, I guess you'll have no problem finding examples.

Indeed I do not . Mirkiin , no eyes guy , Chrys does it , Jerkol , Sangoro , Quainypoo .

If you have any examples of where a person did allow a mana ball they saw coming to hit and injure them for no sound reason (injury , and distraction are sound reasons for example) , besides the ones I've already provided , do show them .
Perfectly plausible, even likely, only... Not something we should have to guess about by chapter 44. *wutno*

Jerkhol stated that children are little threat to an adult in a straight on fight, in the link above . (assuming both are warriors)


None of which is a reason to just pretend I didn't make the second part, rather then just directing those completes at it. *wutno*

Actually they all are . If you can't state your argument plainly , I see no reason to analyse it thoroughly . If you state it simply , you could probably figure out some possible solutions on your own .
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Re: Power Rankings.

Postby Shgon Dunstan » Tue Nov 26, 2013 2:46 pm

MEK1724 wrote:All else equal yes . However all of those children had opportunity to spend years practising said skill you mention . If a commoner would need similar levels of time and training to pull it off effectively , this may well be out of their price range (time spent learning , is time spent not earning money , which obviously gives it a fairly hefty cost compared to not spending time learning to do it) . Unless you are arguing that it is something which they would learn as children , like say how walking is , (with no evidence as far as I can see ,supporting this) this is a sufficient explanation for why they can't do it .
For example many people have no idea how to shoot guns accurately , however children can learn how to do it , and surpass most adults with no training .
Even given that they can , does not imply that anyone will .


Yeah... Because we've seen so many cases of untrained commoners fighting other untrained commoners... Oh wait, what we've seen in warriors fighting other warriors.

Yeah some might of been "born" commoners, and some might not of even been warriors long, but a lot of them have, and those that have have had plenty of time to learn what6 amounts to basic combat training, and given what it does, it would still be "basic" if it was the hardest use of mana-art to learn, as the guys without it would be doing a lot more dieing then those with it. You don't bring a knife to a gun fight, and you don't bring mana to a fight against those who can no-sell everything you try with it.

I have . A demonstration of your case would be , someone who had no reason not to dispell a deadly projectile flung at them failing to doing so and being injured or killed . (for example Maya)


I'll get to this later farther down.

Indeed I do not . Mirkiin

...Man does linking a bunch of stuff like that make it an eyesore to quote. ^^;

Anyway...

Mirkiin is one I didn't remember, though he almost looks to be deflecting it(it dissipating higher then she shot it).



Not really sure he didn't just tank it, as it clearly hurt him, but... Given what it did to Maya, I guess the guy is just bad at it.

Chrys does it ,


Aka:the same kid we were just talking about.



Also already knew of him.



Odd that you'd keep insisting it only works on mana-balls, and then show it not only used on something else, by being said to work on all sorcery, pretty much proving my point for me. *ooo*

Thanks, I had completely forgotten about that page myself. :3


Also know of that one, though... Looking at them all together... Why do we think that "Dispel" and "absorb" are two different abilities again? They don't look all that different, save for some seeming to be better at it. *hmmm*

If you have any examples of where a person did allow a mana ball they saw coming to hit and injure them for no sound reason (injury , and distraction are sound reasons for example) , besides the ones I've already provided , do show them .


Only, as you yourself just provided the proof of, it doesn't just work on mana balls, so... Pretty much every time a drow over 50 years old, with even a dozen of those spent fighting/training to fight, has been in a fight where the other guy is using mana-arts.

Jerkhol stated that children are little threat to an adult in a straight on fight, in the link above . (assuming both are warriors)


...So "me"="all adult drow" now? *wutno*


Actually they all are . If you can't state your argument plainly , I see no reason to analyse it thoroughly . If you state it simply , you could probably figure out some possible solutions on your own .


So you do it just to be a confrontational ass-hole?

"Grammar nazi" is fine, it's just a part of the internet, but "being a dick just to make a point" is a whole different thing. *hmmm*
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Re: Power Rankings.

Postby MEK1724 » Tue Nov 26, 2013 4:01 pm

Shgon Dunstan wrote:So you do it just to be a confrontational ass-hole?

No . I quite clearly responded to your second part immediately below it , this is not in any way shape or form ignoring it . I simply did not put any effort into showing you where mana was dispelled , seeing as how you did not seem to provide any information as to what showed that it was rare. That which is stated without evidence can be dismissed without evidence . What I did do was pointing out ;
1) You stated that mana was rarely dispelled.(I'm not sure what shows it is rare because you don't say , hence the how above it)
2) You stated that a kid doing what Chrys did would imply that it should be done more often .

However
1) Most things which demonstrate it being used offensively , show it being dispelled , or otherwise cancelled out . (6 instances of it happening in fact , I have subsequently provided to you) .
2) Mana is used to kill only 2 people .

Thus given that the tally is 2 kills to 6 prevented , dispelling can not strictly be called rare , as that would imply that someone was failing to use it it when they had every reason to do so to save their life. Every time someone has had a reason to use dispelling they have used it .(or they have in some other manner prevented themselves being murdered)

Your name calling is frankly worthless , to enlightening anyone about any of their questions , which I wouldn't thought that someone who liked to make so many broad statements , or ask so many questions would do .
Good day .
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Re: Power Rankings.

Postby H'K'Maly » Wed Nov 27, 2013 1:15 am

Shgon Dunstan wrote:
H'K'Maly wrote:
Did noone though about that bit that just because Chrystel was able to dispel Ariel's mana bolts it doesn't mean she would be able to do the same to Sill'ice (to name someone she actually fought with)?

Perfectly plausible, even likely, only... Not something we should have to guess about by chapter 44. *wutno*


I agree that we should not be guessing. But we do. Yes, we know so little about drowtales magic that we can't say for sure if it's true or not.

MEK1724 wrote:
Shgon Dunstan wrote:And if it's seen so frequently among warriors, I guess you'll have no problem finding examples.

Indeed I do not . Mirkiin , no eyes guy , Chrys does it , Jerkol , Sangoro , Quainypoo .


And Mirkin basically SAYS that he shouldn't be able to defend against Ariel. Might easily mean he shouldn't be able to dispel mana bolt from girl of Ariel age. Hell, that mana bolt LOOKED lame.

And about the "no eyes guy" ... actually, he's Xuile'solen and he may have natural resistance to magic due to that fact.
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Re: Power Rankings.

Postby hiller » Sun Dec 15, 2013 5:29 am

sunhawk wrote:Who is the most powerful Elf in Chel?

Kharla, Diva, Ash'waren, Waes'soloth, Sil'lice, Sarv'swati, Chirinide, Faen, Airel, Quain'tana

Which elf has the personal power to defeat anyone else in a 1v1 conflict?


If we go by physical power, Quain'tana and Sarv'swati are definitely the most skilled Chellian fighters, with Farasank Siyah'khorshed (the Black Sun leader Sarv'swati fought to get them to provide mercenaries for her) being right up there with them.
If we also include magical power, Snadhya'rune is probably the most powerful at the moment except for maybe Ashwaren. I'm not sure how well Diva's doing at regaining her lost power, but prior to her soul fusion with Ragini, she was definitely the most powerful overall in Chel.
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