[Hetros]

Nope, Hanen has no idea where we are. We never sent a messenger with a map written with a X near the lake. We have never seen a single halme in 8 years near our city. Most halmes are terrified of the predators that live in the forest. And who will be stupid enough to reveal the info? IF someone in our clan tells the halme where our city is. He better run since half the clan will want his head on a pike and kill all the halmes who said moron came into contact to ensure our city location remains a secret and a myth.

I have to agree... it's really really stupid to keep our city a "myth"

If we could build a city that melded into the forest somehow? Or was underground just under the forest? or otherwise, you know, HIDDEN! not built on the coast of a lake like any other city is? Yeah. Sure, we could pull it off.

YOU
CAN
NOT
HIDE
A
CITY

IT CANNOT BE DONE! You can OBSFUCATE your location for a SMALL PERIOD

But if we are to expand

If we are to get allies

If we are to get resources to improve our defenses for any attacks that may or may not come our way when the exodus from the underworld begins because the nidritchral fucked up the underworld with demon magics

We are going to need trade routes

Trade routes mean that our city's location WILL BE REVEALED.

Anyone who could -really- threaten us will already know our location. They're in the underworld. I'm sure the Nals will make our colony common knowledge down there as a lucrative surface trade point once we become such. And if we want to continue trading with the Nal's, we'd BETTER become a lucrative surface trade point... that is why they are funding us.

edit:
Also, if you want to prove me wrong. Name a single settlement in all of recorded history that managed to remain "hidden" from the rest of the world for any extended amount of time and rose to some kind of prominence at the same time -.- it doesn't work like that. We either hide, and remain weak and poor because that's the price you pay to ensure no one knows about you, or we open our doors to trade, bolster our military, and make it so that anyone who WANTS to bite a hunk out of us will think TWICE about doing so.

[minalia]

We already have Nal traders and folks we can deal with at home already.
The dwarves are coming to us wanting to talk and desire our help for their needs.

The Ferals can be a source of trade because they can find things for us that we simply don't know about how to look but they can. Also they are able to detect diseases. Perfect watchdogs(watchcats) to quarantine sick folks.

Both are right here, right now. The halmes on the other hand is something we as drows know next to nothing, we do not know their level of tech, culture, language. This is a big culture shock waiting to happen.

We have to work on the short term and establish our military might like we have discussed. We cannot deal with folks from outside the forest right now. Do we want to deal with military halmes who follow a road from hanen straight to our city or have relic hunters from chel who might want to kill our relic hunters because they followed roads we built towards ruins we plundered already and they see our folks carrying the loot in the next 10-15 turns from now? It only takes 2 person to build a road to hanen and they can reach it in less then 3 weeks from now. And Thalar told us there would be very heavy consequences if we do so.

[James Rye]

Only around half of our warriors are active and leveling up.

About trading:
I rather trade with the much bigger halme village south at the lake than Hanen. What we´ve seen around 10 years ago was an already big village with walls and big buildings, it probably even grew in that time. On the map it covers 3 panels. It has a good position near a street and a lake and ofc near the forest for the woods. If they have a port and the lake is connected to other bigger cities then there might have traders from other countries, even emberi could be among them.

Thus i asked the ferals or their talky-talky Mirual what they know about that village and if they´re friendly or dangerous.

For now:
Lets focus on building our city, strengthen our defense, smithign more tools for explorers and warriors, explore more on the map, find new ores for more independance/new items/tools/projects and deepen our relationship with the dvergar and maybe some feral tribe we might find in the future.

Come to think of it:
did anyone ask Mirual if they know any feral tribes living in this forest? o.o

[Hetros]

No one is arguing that building the road to Hanen before we have proper defenses and and have made friendly contact (or wiped out any threat) is a bad idea in the extreme.

I am certainly not arguing it.

I'm arguing that we WILL need to build that road eventually.

We WILL need to open trade at some point to expand and the more surface trade we have the more rich we'll be from trade with the underworld and vice versa.

Finally. It is arguing that while we are not CURRENTLY KNOWN to them, we WILL BE at some point. That much is almost certain. We are a city, swiftly growing into one. The smoke from our cooking fires alone will give us away in time. You can't hide a settlement that uses fire, sorry, doesn't happen. If we put up smoke plumes, people will know we're here the MOMENT they get within around 50 miles of our settlement. Hanen might not be THAT close, but I'll bet MONEY they have people who COME that close to us.

We will be found out eventually. We should do it on OUR terms the moment we are SECURE. We should -not- try to keep ourselves hidden past that point because THEN we will not be able to choose when we are discovered, we will only be able to prolong the inevitable.

My goal is to get our walls and moat FINISHED, get our food stores BUILT UP, get a decent water supply INSIDE OUR WALLS, and getting us those ballista built to counter sieges and heavy enemies and those damn birds. Once we have that, and nothing looks like it'll be bad on the horizon, I argue we make contact, and make agreements if possible to build roads between our settlements to promote trade.

[laserkid]

A road in I18 needs to be constructed, apparently the function of roads is not only setting the the movement speed to 2 how all classes (-hunter & explorers) but connects us to the ware house inventory system. But it only works up/down/left/right not diagonal.

[minalia]

The second part of the bath house cannot be built at this next turn, due to the fact i don't have the plans from the player who promised me he get the thing but he went MIA a few days ago, and i do not have any clay available in the inventory to make the pipes to transport the waters.

Guess il go with plan B.

[Timotheus]

What do you need? Anything I can help with?

[Jonarus_Drakus]

I've gone into detail so many times in so many other places that it hurts my brain to even consider doing so again...

So, I'll keep it simple and re-state that my 'position' on trade roads is: "WHEN, not IF" - That it is not need 'right now' and can wait until a more advantageous time.

JD

[laserkid]

it is suspected that supporting actions within your own class is the cause of the level reset. The bug seems to go away at Lvl 1.5.

[Timotheus]

Lakeside dock design - can be expanded as needed

[James Rye]

Did some made or could some make a list of the buidlings we already have build so far? Cause i can´t remember every single one, we have a school, a trader house a house for the books a green house, etc. Maybe with a list we can see easier which building we´re missing.

An arena for fighting/tournaments/etc. could be an idea for the enxt project. Or a beautiful garden with many flowers and some trees and a Pavillion for Anji and Badai to have some romantic dates in.

[goblin6]

I have a request for any architects willing to take the job. I plan to dispatch a hunting party next week to capture some trideers. Do we have a pen or a barn to hold them? If not, can someone build one? Much appreciated to anyone taking the job.

[Wy'shira]

I believe from the GUTF thread that no current pen exists.

An open-air pasture works better for deer than a barn, because they need so much room. It would have to be pretty big with 9ft tall walls to prevent them jumping out. A fourth of it should be divided (diagonally would work best) for the newborns and their mothers, as otherwise a herd will... trample their young in captivity. They would eventually need a barn-like enclosure which would provide shelter during storms and the winter, but that could wait until after we have the trideer for a while.

Eventually after the trideer are domesticated, they will need a steady supply of food, but right now they can forage on their own. They can survive on an open-air pasture for the most part, because they do eat grass although they prefer a more varied habitat. We will need an area for water troughs, though.

[Hetros]

If I might suggest, a 9 foot tall FENCE would be cheaper and easier to build and maintain. It's how deer farms in Louisiana operate. It lets stuff like grass seeds and such blow in and repopulate the pastures.

[Wy'shira]

Ah, yes, fence. A wall wouldn't work at all. Thanks, Het.