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Portals to other worlds?

Portals to other worlds?

Postby Gunbird » Sun Jul 26, 2015 8:44 pm

Is it posable for the summoners to open portals to other worlds other then the nether ones? I tried to find out on the wiki but I could't find anything.
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Re: Portals to other worlds?

Postby Dalvyserran » Sun Jul 26, 2015 9:29 pm

All portals lead only to netherworlds. You are living in one, but the only way to enter the world of DT is to die and be lucky enough to be either called forth or have one opened near you.
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Re: Portals to other worlds?

Postby Gunbird » Mon Jul 27, 2015 5:44 pm

Dalvyserran wrote: You are living in one, but the only way to enter the world of DT is to die and be lucky enough to be either called forth or have one opened near you.


I didn't understand that.
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Re: Portals to other worlds?

Postby is-ness » Wed Jul 29, 2015 8:20 pm

Gunbird wrote:
Dalvyserran wrote: You are living in one, but the only way to enter the world of DT is to die and be lucky enough to be either called forth or have one opened near you.


I didn't understand that.

To clarify: A netherworld is a world that is not the DT world and there are infinitely many of them. By this definition, our own world is a netherworld, and any other world you want to open a portal to would also be a netherworld. This is what Dalvy means by "you are living in one."

In answer to your question, yes it is theoretically possible to open portals to any world other than the DT one, but doing so follows the rules of the universe regarding nether. In general, most drow can only pull something through, be it nether, demons, or demon gods. How that works is fairly well established in comic. Only Sharess has ever sent something through and that was herself. There was a daydream story about that and what she did looked a lot like what Diva did to inhabit her new body in Longest Wait (and Diva also claims it is similar magic in LW) so we might be able to draw some conclusions from that about how it works. There were also some daydream stories about what happened once Sharess reached the other side of the portal, but I haven't read them so I can't help you there. But daydream isn't generally treated as canon anyway, so there's that.
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Re: Portals to other worlds?

Postby aceofAces » Thu Jul 30, 2015 12:23 am

Obsidian Agent wrote:Then, that just raises questions as to what nether actually is. I always assumed that Netherworlds were like the Warp from Warhammer 40K crossed with Star Trek's version of subspace - with its infinite domains.

So does this mean that something corporeal can be pulled through a Nether Gate - in theory?


This is my take on how or if it's possible to bring something corporeal through a nether gate, so take it with a grain of salt.

From what I can tell, it looks more like those that are pulled through are incorporeal and energy based, even if they do carry varying degrees of intelligence and/or sapience. I'd say it's much like the Terminator franchise's time machines only being able to transport anything organic through time, but anything inorganic is incapable of doing that. If a similar mechanism is at play, then much like how Terminators are encased in living tissue to circumvent that little hangup, a similar tactic could work, encasing a living being in an energy filed that would be conducive to travel through a nether gate, then it theoretically could work.

Though honestly, I doubt that a) any drow would want to bring something through that keeps its physical form (possibly fearing something similar to Cthulu coming through) or b) would even think of that possibility since in their eyes, netherworlds are regions of pure energy and therefore do not contain beings with physical forms, since the only things they've seen come through are beings of pure mana.

Though this also raises the question of: Do nether summoners essentially suck out the souls of being in the worlds they open up portals to? If that's the case, the nids and the vloz just got a whole lot creepier.

Also can you guys tell I was bored as shit to come up with this?
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Re: Portals to other worlds?

Postby is-ness » Thu Jul 30, 2015 6:10 am

aceofAces wrote:Though this also raises the question of: Do nether summoners essentially suck out the souls of being in the worlds they open up portals to? If that's the case, the nids and the vloz just got a whole lot creepier.

That is what I think Nether is. At least, the evidence we've seen seems to point to that.

First, there's the tainted who have a seed of nether planted into themselves. Seeds can have varying intelligence from animal-like, to sentient, to demon god. Tainting has three to four possible end-games: either you fall to your taint (Naal, Sabrror), you merge with your taint (Snad, Keil), you allow Snad to help you merge with your taint (Jiaan, Shinae), or you become a velakar (Khaless, Umpus). I personally differentiate between the two types of merges because they appear different to me, but that may not be true. The point is that no matter what end-game you choose, it looks a lot like the summoners are placing two souls in one body, then letting those souls come to some form of consensus. Either one of the two dominates, or they reach some sort of compromise, but the end result is a little bit of both, whether you merge, become velakar, or go demon.

Second, there's Sharess and Diva, who are the only two shown to have potentially gone the other way. In Diva's case, she dominated Ragini totally and the body became Diva. Chiri commented that what Diva did looks remarkably like tainting. Then there's Sharess, who is worshipped for going to the netherworlds to close the gates from the other side. Both had to separate their aura, which the drow view as the closest thing to a soul, from their bodies and send it elsewhere.

Obsidian Agent wrote:So does this mean that something corporeal can be pulled through a Nether Gate - in theory?

The closest thing in comic to what you're talking about are Kiel's helpers that manifest near Naal, which Kiel noted was weird and she was just rolling with it. But I can't tell if they're corporeal or not because sometimes other characters who are not Kiel act like they can see the manifested ones, and sometimes they act like they can't. But since Drow can sense nether without seeing it (hello Kyorl), it could be that the Not-Kiel characters are reacting to that, and not to actually seeing Kiel's manifested helpers. So, in answer to your question... maybe?
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Re: Portals to other worlds?

Postby Gunbird » Thu Jul 30, 2015 6:14 am

Obsidian Agent wrote:Then, that just raises questions as to what nether actually is. I always assumed that Netherworlds were like the Warp from Warhammer 40K crossed with Star Trek's version of subspace - with its infinite domains.

So does this mean that something corporeal can be pulled through a Nether Gate - in theory?


Well I was going to use the portals as a them for my Drow VS Humans RP.

is-ness and Ace did pointed out that such a thing is not possible in the Moonless Age canon
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Re: Portals to other worlds?

Postby Doom Chinchilla » Sat Aug 01, 2015 11:31 pm

aceofAces wrote:
Obsidian Agent wrote:Though honestly, I doubt that a) any drow would want to bring something through that keeps its physical form (possibly fearing something similar to Cthulu coming through)


Well, except Snadhya'runes, or course. She would willingly summon Cthulhu and Hastur and Dagon.

I find it interesting that demons bring some of their own energy when pulled into the Drowverse, as proven by the Demon God when he was absorbed into Kharla's aura, expanding it like a balloon. Before that, I always assumed that demons were pure sentiences, data if you like, like computer viruses that required a physical computer to exist (fae) or electromagnetic waves to be transmitted (ambient mana).

The fact that demons bring energy means that, theorically speaking, somebody could use nether gates like energy sources for machines.
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Re: Portals to other worlds?

Postby is-ness » Mon Aug 03, 2015 9:04 am

Doom Chinchilla wrote:The fact that demons bring energy means that, theorically speaking, somebody could use nether gates like energy sources for machines.


Do they bring energy, or are they made of energy? I can't tell. Regardless, I think it's safe to assume that the amount of energy per demon is finite and proportionate to the size of the demon.

If they bring energy, a machine that uses them as a power source would likely be problematic and inefficient. You'd want to summon large demons, not small ones, because you'd want to minimize the number of demons a summoner summons per shift while maximizing the energy harvested. But then you'd have to separate the energy from the demon and immediately reseal it since you don't want it to remain loose in the world and start consuming all the mana nearby. Furthermore, since demons bring energy, I'd think the summoners would have to expend energy to send them back because of conservation of energy, right? If the summoner is expending energy to reseal the demon, which is likely the case in this scenario, any machine that uses their energy to power it is going to be inherently inefficient.

If they are made of energy, this isn't a problem. All that would be needed would be to develop a way to convert demonic energy into a more desirable type of energy. The conversion would destroy the demon in the sense that it won't be a demon anymore, so you wouldn't have to worry about them running amok and likely wouldn't need a summoner except for setup and occasional maintenance.

And at this point I am way overthinking this.
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Re: Portals to other worlds?

Postby Doom Chinchilla » Mon Aug 03, 2015 4:26 pm

is-ness wrote:
Doom Chinchilla wrote:The fact that demons bring energy means that, theorically speaking, somebody could use nether gates like energy sources for machines.


Do they bring energy, or are they made of energy? I can't tell. Regardless, I think it's safe to assume that the amount of energy per demon is finite and proportionate to the size of the demon.

If they bring energy, a machine that uses them as a power source would likely be problematic and inefficient. You'd want to summon large demons, not small ones, because you'd want to minimize the number of demons a summoner summons per shift while maximizing the energy harvested. But then you'd have to separate the energy from the demon and immediately reseal it since you don't want it to remain loose in the world and start consuming all the mana nearby. Furthermore, since demons bring energy, I'd think the summoners would have to expend energy to send them back because of conservation of energy, right? If the summoner is expending energy to reseal the demon, which is likely the case in this scenario, any machine that uses their energy to power it is going to be inherently inefficient.

If they are made of energy, this isn't a problem. All that would be needed would be to develop a way to convert demonic energy into a more desirable type of energy. The conversion would destroy the demon in the sense that it won't be a demon anymore, so you wouldn't have to worry about them running amok and likely wouldn't need a summoner except for setup and occasional maintenance.

And at this point I am way overthinking this.


You could develop a nether gate that summoned demons directly into a core, and then use that core as a power source, sucking those demons dry until killing them.

The advantage of the system would be that you could use the demon-powered golem engine to propel trucks and ships on the surface; you could keep summoning demons into the cores for energy during the trip.

And if you had to spend energy to send those demons back, no problem, do that inside a mana pool once you are back home.
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Re: Portals to other worlds?

Postby Sonor Val'Illhar'dro » Tue Aug 04, 2015 8:08 am

Trying to power a golem with nether energy is like trying to power a radio with something like...anti-electricity. What is anti-electricity? We don't know. We can't even conceptualize it.


Ether and nether are essentially disembodied auras. Auras without a vessel. Auras without a source of energy to replenish and stabilize its existence.

Ether is the disembodied aura of a DT fae (this universe) who's main structural component is mana.
Nether is the disembodied aura of any non-DT fae-like creature (any universe)

Let's me hypothesize that the physical fae body or form contains cells that produce mana. We can make this guess since we know that auras need mana in order to sustain itself and the body. If a fae dies and the mana source (body) is gone, the aura no longer has anything to 'attach' to and eventually dissipates.

Ether is composed of mana (an energy form). Once a stabilized aura possesses another ether bearing creature, the ether is still able to produce 'mana'.

Nether is composed of x, y, z foreign energy (lets call it anti-mana, another energy form). In order to compensate for the lack of anti-mana in the DT world, nether needs to consume some sort of energy to maintain its 'form', in this case mana is the abundant and most accessible form of energy in the DT world.

But here's the key difference, there are no natural anti-mana bearing creatures in the DT universe. The basic biology of the fae creatures is to produce mana, not anti-mana. All energy possessing beings in the DT universe are ether bearing creatures. A demon can possess a mana producing vessel, but the cells of the vessel are hardwired to produce mana, not anti-mana. Yes, the demon has a consistent energy source to draw from but they will produce no anti-mana. Demons can only consume and cannot produce mana themselves in their new bodies (since the nether is now exclusively using the body as an energy source, there is no ambient mana to release).


Pure nether energy by virtue of its existence, exists to draw in mana energy. Nether energy cannot interact with mana without consuming it. There would be no way of controlling a nether powered golem since the inscription of the golem foci would have to be done with mana, which would be absorbed which would then make it useless. Any commands via usage of mana or your aura would be consumed.

Of course, this is all theoretical and based on my understandings so far of auras, nether, ether, and summoning as gathered from the MA, DD and RH.
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Re: Portals to other worlds?

Postby Gunbird » Tue Aug 04, 2015 5:27 pm

That's good information about the demons and how they react to mana, Sonor. But I was asking if the Drow summoners are capable of opening portals to other universes that are not just nether ones?
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Re: Portals to other worlds?

Postby SFI » Tue Aug 04, 2015 6:06 pm

Gunbird wrote:That's good information about the demons and how they react to mana, Sonor. But I was asking if the Drow summoners are capable of opening portals to other universes that are not just nether ones?


No, because every portal reaching out of their world automatically IS a nether-gate by virtue of leaving the world/planet/howeveryouwannacallit.
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Re: Portals to other worlds?

Postby Sonor Val'Illhar'dro » Tue Aug 04, 2015 7:00 pm

Exactly what SFI said.

Demons is a general catch all term for any disembodied energy being from another dimension.

One thing for certain is that physical things are unable to travel through nether gates. No ifs, ands or buts about it. So theoretically, a drow nether summoner could cleave open a gate and there would be non-energy bearing creatures on the other side (like Halmes or animals) BUT it wouldn't matter because only energy can pass through the gate nor could we sense or see it.


tldr; every gate is a nether gate
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Re: Portals to other worlds?

Postby ThatGuyThisGuy » Tue Aug 04, 2015 8:07 pm

What if per say there was a world in which there are inhabitants who possess abilities that can be summed up as turning ethereal so the matter that composes them functions as energy or whatever stuff is accepted by nethergates, and a nethergate opens up near them while they are in a ethereal state and they are sucked in and once in the DT world their ethereal ability wears off and they return to there true matter states.

Also i have a question: Is nether the natural state of whatever energy is in the other worlds or is it the result of transformation that effects the energy when it is brought through the gates? Every other universe having the same type of energy and the DT world being the only place that has "ether" mana seems odd.
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