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Naturally Born Naga and their culture

Naturally Born Naga and their culture

Postby Yu Rei » Sat Nov 16, 2013 5:19 am

I haven't seen this addressed anywhere else, and I'm just curious. Where did the Naga come from? Not the manufactured ones, but the natural species itself...assuming of course it is a natural species.

I don't know much about the Naga so please correct me if I'm wrong about things.

Are they exclusively a "slave caste"? They seem to be prevalent in the Sullissin'rune clan, aside from the feral salesman early on in the story.
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Re: Naturally Born Naga and their culture

Postby Ash'arion » Sat Nov 16, 2013 5:36 am

I think the 'naturals' might be descendants of snake-body Awares, like the Driders are for spiders. Which means they should be getting a lot more respect than they ever do.
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Re: Naturally Born Naga and their culture

Postby Yu Rei » Sat Nov 16, 2013 5:40 am

I see. They SHOULD get more respect, however, just like the Driders, I think the "eaten" ones have caused a lot of prejudice among the Drow.
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Re: Naturally Born Naga and their culture

Postby Doom Chinchilla » Sat Nov 16, 2013 9:14 am

The nagas, like the driders, were created when dark elf soldiers were grievously wounded, losing legs or several vital organs, and they were fused with an animal to keep them alive/useful. I think that the latter world setting information about mana science points to old dokkalfar golem being less advanced than modern ones, so they probably weren't able to build golem limbs.

Modern nagas and driders are descended from the few artificial nagas and driders that were able to breed (I guess the ones able to breed were the ones that kept their drow sexual organs when fused with beasts) and have become a species on their own.

Driders and nagas used to be very important and respected among the dark elves, being war heroes, but the drow slaughtered their elders and, with a few exceptions, they don't respect dark elven heroes anymore...plus the naturally born driders and nagas aren't heroes, they are just deformed people.

Vlozz nagas are a completely different thing. The Vlozz'Ress bought biogolem snakes from the Jaal'Darya, and those biogolem snakes capture, drug and brainwash drows, turning them into mindless slaves. The Vlozz'Ress nagas do have legs, but they are into the snake's mouth (they probably atrophy after some time).

What I would like to know is: How good are naturally born nagas and driders at Mana Arts? Could a naturally born naga become a powerful summoner or sorcerer'
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Re: Naturally Born Naga and their culture

Postby Yu Rei » Sat Nov 16, 2013 9:52 am

Doom Chinchilla wrote:The nagas, like the driders, were created when dark elf soldiers were grievously wounded, losing legs or several vital organs, and they were fused with an animal to keep them alive/useful. I think that the latter world setting information about mana science points to old dokkalfar golem being less advanced than modern ones, so they probably weren't able to build golem limbs.

Modern nagas and driders are descended from the few artificial nagas and driders that were able to breed (I guess the ones able to breed were the ones that kept their drow sexual organs when fused with beasts) and have become a species on their own.

Driders and nagas used to be very important and respected among the dark elves, being war heroes, but the drow slaughtered their elders and, with a few exceptions, they don't respect dark elven heroes anymore...plus the naturally born driders and nagas aren't heroes, they are just deformed people.

Vlozz nagas are a completely different thing. The Vlozz'Ress bought biogolem snakes from the Jaal'Darya, and those biogolem snakes capture, drug and brainwash drows, turning them into mindless slaves. The Vlozz'Ress nagas do have legs, but they are into the snake's mouth (they probably atrophy after some time).

What I would like to know is: How good are naturally born nagas and driders at Mana Arts? Could a naturally born naga become a powerful summoner or sorcerer'


Ah, I see. That's very interesting to think about.

Naga and Drider that are able to reproduce could, theoretically break away from Drow society and form their own civilization.

And that is a good question. Can they become sorcerers? Are there Naga sorcerers we don't know about?
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Re: Naturally Born Naga and their culture

Postby Dalvyserran » Sat Nov 16, 2013 10:43 am

Natural naga are the culture of whoever owns them, if they're not independent. Naga are also monotremes
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Re: Naturally Born Naga and their culture

Postby Catriana » Sat Nov 16, 2013 3:39 pm

Since it was naga week and a few of us were curious, the subject came up around Kern and this is what were were told(most text taken from the actual conversation):

* Natural born nagas are fae and live as long as elves.
* They don't always live in groups (in the wild) so don't tend to live as long (no average lifespan was given).
* Not all nagas can use mana but some can. (It was not explained how skilled they could/would be in comparison to elves)
* They are from the same roots as elves (like the dragons) but much more ancient, to the point where there's no record of origin concerning when the two species split.
* They cannot breed with elves.

It is also my understanding that you can get a ballpark figure of a naga's age by the length of their tail, as it never stops growing.

As for culture, I'd have to agree with Dalvy, although since Kern mentioned that there are naga that live in the wild, perhaps there could be independent cultures for them?

With it being Naga Week, today's LS might be a perfect time to get specifics about them from Kern.

I hope that's helpful.
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Re: Naturally Born Naga and their culture

Postby Shgon Dunstan » Sat Nov 16, 2013 3:48 pm

Catriana wrote:* They cannot breed with elves.

Surprising, given that an elves "capable of having offspring with" requirements most of the time seems to just be "has aura, will F^@%". ^^;
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Re: Naturally Born Naga and their culture

Postby Doom Chinchilla » Sat Nov 16, 2013 3:52 pm

So the origin of nagas as dark elf soldiers has been retconned...does that mean that the dokkalfar only used spiders to fuse with their wounded soldiers?

That's kinda weird...why didn't they try other creatures? Maybe vertebrates didn't mesh well with each others?

Well, at least they still come from elven stock, like dragons and driders.

Shgon Dunstan wrote:
Catriana wrote:* They cannot breed with elves.

Surprising, given that an elves "capable of having offspring with" requirements most of the time seems to just be "has aura, will F^@%". ^^;


I think that when Awares, Driders, Nagas, Dragons and all those were first created, most were sterile because their reproductive systems were messed up (Beldrobbaen's driders, for example, are all sterile) but a few lucky ones kept mostly unaltered ovaries and testes, and produced normal elven sperm and ova, being able to breed with each other (natural driders) and with elves (Zor).

Those creatures were genetically elven, but the offspring kept the monstrous shape of their parents because the aura of the mother shapes that of the offspring in some way (that's a phenomenon that helped the Jaals understand how an aura can infuence and shape other creature's aura and shape).

The aura seems to keep the memory of the elf's shape; that's the reason Diva's aura changed Ragini's body into a copy of her own old body, the aura remembered how her own body used to be and forced a change on Ragini (that's the basis of the Jaal's sciense, tricking the aura into "believing" that the body should have different shape). That's the reason drider moms produce drider babies and not elven babies.

But since nagas are so ancient, maybe they have evolved to a point that either their reproductive systems can not work with elven reproductive system, or their genome has evolved and become different enough from drow's as to genetically be a different species, or maybe a bit of snake genetic material has gotten mixed with the elven one, separating them from elves.
Last edited by Doom Chinchilla on Sat Nov 16, 2013 4:54 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Naturally Born Naga and their culture

Postby Catriana » Sat Nov 16, 2013 4:33 pm

I wouldn't consider it retconned, just that there is an actual race of naga in the world. I think that's why in the conversation 'natural' was emphasized.
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Re: Naturally Born Naga and their culture

Postby Doom Chinchilla » Sat Nov 16, 2013 4:50 pm

Catriana wrote:I wouldn't consider it retconned, just that there is an actual race of naga in the world. I think that's why in the conversation 'natural' was emphasized.


The natural nagas already existed; for example, this guy. And then there were artificial, almost mindless Vlozz-created nagas, like this gal. Or those. Or our dear Naal'ga, who is becoming less mindless as she ages (the special treatment and feeding she recieves may help too).

The diference is, natural born nagas used to be descended from wounded dark elven soldiers who where saved that way. Now, natural born nagas have elven origins too, but said origins are a lot more remote, and natural born nagas have been around for a lot more time.
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Re: Naturally Born Naga and their culture

Postby Shgon Dunstan » Sat Nov 16, 2013 5:04 pm

Doom Chinchilla wrote:The diference is, natural born nagas used to be descended from wounded dark elven soldiers who where saved that way. Now, natural born nagas have elven origins too, but said origins are a lot more remote, and natural born nagas have been around for a lot more time.

I knew the "merged with animals" part, but I thought it worked by merging them with ones that already had auras, not by first giving a "soulless" animal mana, and then merging them... Wouldn't that work just as easily on a human as a snake? *ooo*

Also... It said "mana" not "aura", and called it a "new soul", only... Isn't it the aura the elves see as the "soul", not the mana that it holds?
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Re: Naturally Born Naga and their culture

Postby Doom Chinchilla » Sat Nov 16, 2013 5:27 pm

Shgon Dunstan wrote:
Doom Chinchilla wrote:The diference is, natural born nagas used to be descended from wounded dark elven soldiers who where saved that way. Now, natural born nagas have elven origins too, but said origins are a lot more remote, and natural born nagas have been around for a lot more time.

I knew the "merged with animals" part, but I thought it worked by merging them with ones that already had auras, not by first giving a "soulless" animal mana, and then merging them... Wouldn't that work just as easily on a human as a snake? *ooo*

Also... It said "mana" not "aura", and called it a "new soul", only... Isn't it the aura the elves see as the "soul", not the mana that it holds?


You have to give the critter a slice of your own aura. Anyways, the animal won't be able to use mana, it can't even perceive it.

And yes, it could in theory be done to humans.
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Re: Naturally Born Naga and their culture

Postby Yu Rei » Sat Nov 16, 2013 6:24 pm

I'm liking all the conversation this is creating. So, I came up with two new questions while I was trying to sleep.

Naga babies: Eggs or live birth?

Do Naga shed their skin? Well, the part that's a snake, anyway.
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Re: Naturally Born Naga and their culture

Postby Doom Chinchilla » Sat Nov 16, 2013 6:28 pm

Yu Rei wrote:I'm liking all the conversation this is creating. So, I came up with two new questions while I was trying to sleep.

Naga babies: Eggs or live birth?

Do Naga shed their skin? Well, the part that's a snake, anyway.


Dalvyserran@ said that:

Dalvyserran wrote:Natural naga are the culture of whoever owns them, if they're not independent. Naga are also monotremes


Monotremes = "Lay eggs, but produce milk to feed the hatchlings"

But I don't know if that has been changed lately...
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