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Chapter 54 :page 10

Re: Chapter 54 :page 10

Postby sunhawk » Mon Jan 22, 2018 10:49 pm

How come Quain is the only one we see getting stabbed in the womb?
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Re: Chapter 54 :page 10

Postby Dalvyserran » Mon Jan 22, 2018 11:11 pm

sunhawk wrote:How come Quain is the only one we see getting stabbed in the womb?

We don't see that in the comic, only the after effect.
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Re: Chapter 54 :page 10

Postby Varam » Mon Jan 22, 2018 11:35 pm

Remember, when stabbing through a ribcage, make sure to turn the blade so that it is parallel to the ribs. This allows it to slip in more easily and makes it less likely you’ll get stuck between two ribs than if the blade is perpendicular to them.

But as for Kyo, DAMN...I did not see that coming at all. I thought she was hardening herself for diplomatic talky talky betrayal. Theorizing, I think it was her first kill. Look at the way the blade is, perpendicular to the ribs.
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Re: Chapter 54 :page 10

Postby Mizu » Tue Jan 23, 2018 12:21 am

sunhawk wrote:How come Quain is the only one we see getting stabbed in the womb?


Maybe it is considered impolite to wound your opponent such? It would be a weird hill for them to plant their sword on given all the torture and such but sometimes people are weird.
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Re: Chapter 54 :page 10

Postby Naur » Tue Jan 23, 2018 2:31 am

Samireh wrote:
PoignardAzur wrote:
Samireh wrote:This...is way too drastic of a change from Kyo'nne. I've got a few (possible) crackpot theories running around in my head about her right now, Snad's habit of making folks into identical summons being the leading one.

She can't be trusted, and this is depressing.


I agreed. At that point I just want the character to be dropped out of the story one way or another. I don't care whether she is a traitor, or whether she's supposed to learn some sort of lesson or whatever. I just want the story to move on to the compelling characters.


I mean, I am interested in seeing what's really motivating her. She's been one of the most evolved of the child cast. My depression is that she's secretly been a favourite of mine, so to see her off a pregnant woman is...ick. Felt the same way when it was Zala and Shinae.


I'm sort of hoping still for a bit of a redemption arc. When she was bubbly and hopeful she was perhaps too far "light side" for her own good, now she's too far "dark side", but with Ariel saving her perhaps a speck of hope remains for her to find a healthy balance and be a complete and developed character. It remains to be seen where it goes though, right now can only cross fingers and speculate.
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Re: Chapter 54 :page 10

Postby Kardwill » Tue Jan 23, 2018 1:02 pm

Mizu wrote: Its Snadyha's fault for apparently being someone that does that to subordinates that fail frequently enough for people to buy someone she sent just murdering an 'incompetent' like it wasn't even a thing (and even taking it as proof that she was legit).

Most scary thing about this page once the "OMG cute lil' Kyo just stabbed a pregnant woman to death" shock is over : the (lack of) reaction of everyone in the room. They're not panicked, nor surprised, nor really shocked. They don't beg, don't call for help, don't protest. Only one of them comes to aid their wounded comrade. The others just... frown?

To them, it looks like this is politics as usual. They're just unhappy they're on the wrong side of the knife today.

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Re: Chapter 54 :page 10

Postby Smokehammer » Tue Jan 23, 2018 6:02 pm

To be fair to Snad, she doesnt have absolute control over anything, Diva liked to chop people up into cubes and even fair & basically gentle Nega approved of rebels being tortured to death in front of her. There's a huge chance this is just "business as usual" for their culture and unlike Ariel, Kyo's "all grown up" because she's lost her idealism. Its hard to see it that was because the guards are upset and shocked, but they too are part of Ariel's clump of "better people".
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Re: Chapter 54 :page 10

Postby Ardan Styyx » Tue Jan 23, 2018 8:38 pm

Smokehammer wrote:To be fair to Snad, she doesnt have absolute control over anything, Diva liked to chop people up into cubes and even fair & basically gentle Nega approved of rebels being tortured to death in front of her. There's a huge chance this is just "business as usual" for their culture and unlike Ariel, Kyo's "all grown up" because she's lost her idealism. Its hard to see it that was because the guards are upset and shocked, but they too are part of Ariel's clump of "better people".


You have a point. The level of violence accepted as 'normal' within Drow society goes obviously beyond the one of, say, our relatively quite western world. Now, despite Drow being a matriarchal society, I would have thought killing pregnant women might not be a taboo but at least would appear as VERY violent. That probably was Kyo's point, by the way.

Still, this radical change of a major character's behavior was not foreseen. Or maybe it could have been, but anyway, it requires further explanations, at least to give more coherence and flesh to this whole sequence (as well as allowing a new, more complex approach of Kyo's character).
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Re: Chapter 54 :page 10

Postby sunhawk » Wed Jan 24, 2018 12:30 am

Shinae stabbed zala'ess in the womb, though zala was pretending to be pregnant at the time. Shinae was also upset over her failed pregnancy.

Quain is still the only one known to be wounded in the womb on purpose,for the purpose of leaving her barren and humiliated.
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Re: Chapter 54 :page 10

Postby Moric » Wed Jan 24, 2018 12:46 am

sunhawk wrote:Shinae stabbed zala'ess in the womb, though zala was pretending to be pregnant at the time. Shinae was also upset over her failed pregnancy.

Quain is still the only one known to be wounded in the womb on purpose,for the purpose of leaving her barren and humiliated.

We aren't sure if it was intentional. Likely it was simply the only available opening in a protacted fight. Heck, we don't even know if it was a duel proper or just two heroes meeting amidst the general melee. I doubt Sarv would have chosen to wound and not kill after all.

As for Shinae, stabbing Zala in the womb is stabbing the source of her life's misery.
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Re: Chapter 54 :page 10

Postby sunhawk » Wed Jan 24, 2018 12:59 am

Moric wrote:
sunhawk wrote:Shinae stabbed zala'ess in the womb, though zala was pretending to be pregnant at the time. Shinae was also upset over her failed pregnancy.

Quain is still the only one known to be wounded in the womb on purpose,for the purpose of leaving her barren and humiliated.

We aren't sure if it was intentional. Likely it was simply the only available opening in a protacted fight. Heck, we don't even know if it was a duel proper or just two heroes meeting amidst the general melee. I doubt Sarv would have chosen to wound and not kill after all.

As for Shinae, stabbing Zala in the womb is stabbing the source of her life's misery.


Old art, we saw swarv standing over a wounded Quain in a hall.
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Re: Chapter 54 :page 10

Postby Ardan Styyx » Wed Jan 24, 2018 1:17 am

sunhawk wrote:Shinae stabbed zala'ess in the womb, though zala was pretending to be pregnant at the time. Shinae was also upset over her failed pregnancy.

Quain is still the only one known to be wounded in the womb on purpose,for the purpose of leaving her barren and humiliated.


I may be mistaken but wasn't Shinae under the control of the 'Pupetter' when she actually stabbed Zala?
http://www.drowtales.com/mainarchive.php?sid=10627
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Re: Chapter 54 :page 10

Postby Smokehammer » Wed Jan 24, 2018 2:02 am

Ardan Styyx wrote:
sunhawk wrote:Shinae stabbed zala'ess in the womb, though zala was pretending to be pregnant at the time. Shinae was also upset over her failed pregnancy.

Quain is still the only one known to be wounded in the womb on purpose,for the purpose of leaving her barren and humiliated.


I may be mistaken but wasn't Shinae under the control of the 'Pupetter' when she actually stabbed Zala?
http://www.drowtales.com/mainarchive.php?sid=10627


No because the Puppeteer wasnt controlling merged tainted at the time.

sunhawk wrote:
Moric wrote:
sunhawk wrote:Shinae stabbed zala'ess in the womb, though zala was pretending to be pregnant at the time. Shinae was also upset over her failed pregnancy.

Quain is still the only one known to be wounded in the womb on purpose,for the purpose of leaving her barren and humiliated.

We aren't sure if it was intentional. Likely it was simply the only available opening in a protacted fight. Heck, we don't even know if it was a duel proper or just two heroes meeting amidst the general melee. I doubt Sarv would have chosen to wound and not kill after all.

As for Shinae, stabbing Zala in the womb is stabbing the source of her life's misery.


Old art, we saw swarv standing over a wounded Quain in a hall.
It didnt look like a hall so much as black backdrop in Mel's memories. That being said, Sarv looks like she gloating yes but they both look beat to hell and back (they're both bleeding etc) so I'd say Moric's take on it was pretty fair.
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Re: Chapter 54 :page 10

Postby Basileus_Ioannis » Wed Jan 24, 2018 7:56 am

Smokehammer wrote:
Ardan Styyx wrote:I may be mistaken but wasn't Shinae under the control of the 'Pupetter' when she actually stabbed Zala?
http://www.drowtales.com/mainarchive.php?sid=10627
No because the Puppeteer wasnt controlling merged tainted at the time.
And you can see that because everyone who was controlled had "blacked out" eyes, but Shinae, Zala, Sabrror-demon, the Vloz atop the golem, and later Quain (and the wolves) had normal eyes (later, after Kiel reentered the Vloz tower, she too was 'puppeted' despite her merged tainting, so wonder if that was just proximity, or did Kharla do it consciously despite the fact that it would make Kiel follow the command to "kill the Ill'haresses" even though Kharla herself was an Ill'haress? *hmmm* )
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Re: Chapter 54 :page 10

Postby Junglefowl26 » Wed Jan 24, 2018 9:26 am

Kyo: Or, first you were worred about me helping them, now you are mad at me for stabbing them? Make up your mind dude!

Or:

Kyo's player: Alright let's see what my dialogue wheel options are
"They'll be here soon..."
" I don't know"
[Prevent the Escape"
Ah, the last one sounds good, I can call for help or use my spel- *eek*
*sigh* stupid dialogue wheel....



PoignardAzur wrote:I'm kind of hoping Ariel has her executed, to be honest.

She's the equivalent of the Karstark guy who murdered the Lannisters prisoners, except she's incoherent and she doesn't have any political backing.

Yeah, the Karstarks also came to mind.

Though they did also kill their own allies to get to the prisoners, which is a lot worse.

Oh, and technically these prisoners are trying to escape, and even the laws of war allow killing escaping prisoners...technically...

Though yeah, Ariel will be pissed...though, hard to see her executing Kyo over this. I mean, she risked her life to save Kyo even when they were enemies....

Ardan Styyx wrote:And I thought the Illhar'dro were actually offering a perspective of hope for Drow society... :E *crying*

I am happy I eventually choosed Beldrobbaen as a clan *rolleyes* even if they are probably on the verge of extinction.

Ah yes, the clan going extinct because they are too snobbish and traditionalist with who they breed with. The clan that murders dozens if not hundreds of slaves because one slave did something wrong. The clan that participated in the creation of a slave colony that has been repeatedly described as nightmarish. The clan whose leader, often the most sane and reasonable in her clan, delimbed a Jaal ambassador because she didn't trust their offer. And the clan who was five seconds away from murdering itself in a fit of paranoia before a commoner provided a solution.
What a wondrous beacon of hope for a brighter future. :P

More seriously, Kyo alone isn't her clan, for better or for worse. She had a long path here...as for her clan, I think the opening chapters of the big timeskip are a better representation of them.

Related to human psychology, it is a miracle that Ariel remained a kind and merciful adult considering the horrors she went through during her childhood...
But again, Drow are not humans, are they?

Somewhat. I mean, she had lots of bad shit happen to her, but she had a lot of good experiences as well, strong connections with other people who helped set her on the right path.

In particular, I think Vaelia deserves a lot of credit here - Ariel was going into a self-destructive spiral of depression before Vaelia convinced her to go after Faen, but Vaelia did a lot to teach Ariel to believe in herself and about morality. I think Ariel would have gone to a very dark place without her.

moonwalker wrote:
Junglefowl26 wrote:Whatever happened to the bubbly girl who just wanted love and nice food.... :c


Those kinds of bubbly girls (and kids in general) always turn into the most cynical adults one can find.

Ain't that the sad truth.

Smokehammer wrote:To be fair to Snad, she doesnt have absolute control over anything, Diva liked to chop people up into cubes and even fair & basically gentle Nega approved of rebels being tortured to death in front of her. There's a huge chance this is just "business as usual" for their culture and unlike Ariel, Kyo's "all grown up" because she's lost her idealism. Its hard to see it that was because the guards are upset and shocked, but they too are part of Ariel's clump of "better people".

Wait, when did Diva chop people up into cubes?

I mean, I know in general Diva described herself as ruthless and paranoid, but that sounds like a reference to something specific.

But yeah, drow society can be pretty violent.

Though the guard in this case hasn't been part of Ariel's clump long. Just three years ago she was a very high ranking Nal. Wonder what made her move to Machtike and make her so happy to take the Little Wolf's orders....

Ardan Styyx wrote: The level of violence accepted as 'normal' within Drow society goes obviously beyond the one of, say, our relatively quite western world

Frankly, real life pre-modern societies can be even more violent, and being executed for failure is far from uncommon. "In this country it is good to execute an admiral every once and while, to encourage the rest."

Of course, one can over do it. "The penalty for lateness is death. The penalty for rebellion is death. Since we are already late, we might as well rebel." And thus fell the Qin dynasty.
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