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Chapter 54 : page 1

Re: Chapter 54 : page 1

Postby Black Knight LeFreux » Sat Jan 06, 2018 10:35 am

Smokehammer wrote:
Irae Maeviir wrote:"Oh yes, please, return the still smoking gun to the psychopath that tried to kill you with it. I'm sure she will be so thankful she wont try to murder you right after you do it..."
Maybe Kane'ohe's being sarcastic? I mean who the hell marches up to a known Snadhya sympathizer with HER airship and is like "Let's be friends!!!" I mean she's literally facepalming over Ariel's offer.


That's realpolitik, even if it seems madness.

Right now, Machike's refugees are short on everything : manpower, ressources and support. Forming a temporary coalition with the other colonies may be their best option right now.

A known Snadhya sympathizer ? We know that for sure, we allseeing forumites who have access to cameo concepts and the wiki, but I don't believe it's really clearly cut out for Ariel and Co.
Furthermore, we don't know if every other council member here are really on board with the Felde partnership.

Not to mention that Ys doesn't seem to have really gotten anything from that deal, besides not being obliterated by Snadhya.
"We endured", said Kane'ohe. What are we supposed to understand by that ? My guess is Ys had to defend itself alone, without really any help from Felde and its miracle weapon, which could have wiped a good portion of the goblins army and scared the rest.
But, rather than keeping the goblins at bay, the airship just made regular tours of the colonies, to remind them who their allmighty overlord was.

I may not have any proof for that last bit, but we don't have proof either that the airship was used for anything but terror.

EDIT : the airship WAS Snadhya's property. She can't do much to get it back, or her supporters.
And even if there was a higher entity charged with getting things back to its rightful owner, it would go to the Illardhro rather than Snad. ^^;
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Re: Chapter 54 : page 1

Postby xellos » Sat Jan 06, 2018 10:51 am

I could be massively off the mark here, but I don't think the goal is actually the support of Ys as a whole. I think they're trying to get the minority to defect to their side. We know that the airship can fit at least a dozen squads of soldiers, which is a full-sized army for drow. If they can get that many people, plus supplies, they're in a much better place when the other Sarghress faction shows up at Machike
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Re: Chapter 54 : page 1

Postby Smokehammer » Sat Jan 06, 2018 11:57 am

Black Knight LeFreux wrote:
Smokehammer wrote:
Irae Maeviir wrote:"Oh yes, please, return the still smoking gun to the psychopath that tried to kill you with it. I'm sure she will be so thankful she wont try to murder you right after you do it..."
Maybe Kane'ohe's being sarcastic? I mean who the hell marches up to a known Snadhya sympathizer with HER airship and is like "Let's be friends!!!" I mean she's literally facepalming over Ariel's offer.


That's realpolitik, even if it seems madness.

Right now, Machike's refugees are short on everything : manpower, ressources and support. Forming a temporary coalition with the other colonies may be their best option right now.

A known Snadhya sympathizer ? We know that for sure, we allseeing forumites who have access to cameo concepts and the wiki, but I don't believe it's really clearly cut out for Ariel and Co.
Furthermore, we don't know if every other council member here are really on board with the Felde partnership.

Not to mention that Ys doesn't seem to have really gotten anything from that deal, besides not being obliterated by Snadhya.
"We endured", said Kane'ohe. What are we supposed to understand by that ? My guess is Ys had to defend itself alone, without really any help from Felde and its miracle weapon, which could have wiped a good portion of the goblins army and scared the rest.
But, rather than keeping the goblins at bay, the airship just made regular tours of the colonies, to remind them who their allmighty overlord was.

I may not have any proof for that last bit, but we don't have proof either that the airship was used for anything but terror.

EDIT : the airship WAS Snadhya's property. She can't do much to get it back, or her supporters.
And even if there was a higher entity charged with getting things back to its rightful owner, it would go to the Illardhro rather than Snad. ^^;

Eh? Ys was founded BY Snadhya. I mean maybe Ar's trying to convince them that they should all be like, "Hey, screw the underdark, lets join together and keep the surface", but this is the WORST place she couldve started that. Like literally what was she fooking thinking? Couldnt she have gone to say the Ill'hardro as you mention, they have colonies too (and the Nals etc)? She honestly might as well just go to Snad and be all, "Yo! Here have your airship back because you buy all your shit from ACME !" since she is clearly clueless as to who her enemies are, and/or doesnt fear them in the slightest.


xellos wrote:I could be massively off the mark here, but I don't think the goal is actually the support of Ys as a whole. I think they're trying to get the minority to defect to their side.
Then why not sneak in and look for dissidents? That would generally work better than attempting to parlay with the upper echelon.
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Re: Chapter 54 : page 1

Postby Black Knight LeFreux » Sat Jan 06, 2018 12:49 pm

Smokehammer wrote:Eh? Ys was founded BY Snadhya.


Wait what ? When ? Can you point me to the source of your information, please ? (because I sure as hell didn't know she founded the city).
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Re: Chapter 54 : page 1

Postby Dalvyserran » Sat Jan 06, 2018 1:05 pm

Ys is in a much better position than Ariel's group... why would they rebel against the Empire that now owns Felde (as Zala promised to do), and has been supporting this independent colony with no issue?

Why would they listen to a rebel group that has been blacklisted (and thus cut off from the underworld), and is carrying a ship that is by all rights property of the Empire with Snadhya's "death"?

A lot of you folks forget that readers are all seeing, but characters are not.
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Re: Chapter 54 : page 1

Postby SzordrinZaphresz » Sat Jan 06, 2018 2:09 pm

"Yes. We will certainly consider returning the airship to Felde and then settling our grievance with them, but I'm not sure how much of Felde, or Ys will still be standing by the time we're done. Especially since that Goblin Horde is still coming, armed with weapons far, far too advanced for them to have made themselves. I leave you to interpret that however you will."
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Re: Chapter 54 : page 1

Postby Zarannya » Sat Jan 06, 2018 3:04 pm

Black Knight LeFreux wrote:
Smokehammer wrote:Eh? Ys was founded BY Snadhya.


Wait what ? When ? Can you point me to the source of your information, please ? (because I sure as hell didn't know she founded the city).


Not sure if this helps, but the best answer I could find was here: http://www.drowtales.com/mainarchive.php?sid=8526

Nothing really says Snad founded it, but she was said to be their largest sponsor, for whatever that means in DT. It could be taken as a promise for material and personnel support, as well as assistance with security, unless someone can clarify it otherwise.
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Re: Chapter 54 : page 1

Postby Black Knight LeFreux » Sat Jan 06, 2018 3:46 pm

Zarannya wrote:
Black Knight LeFreux wrote:
Smokehammer wrote:Eh? Ys was founded BY Snadhya.


Wait what ? When ? Can you point me to the source of your information, please ? (because I sure as hell didn't know she founded the city).


Not sure if this helps, but the best answer I could find was here: http://www.drowtales.com/mainarchive.php?sid=8526

Nothing really says Snad founded it, but she was said to be their largest sponsor, for whatever that means in DT. It could be taken as a promise for material and personnel support, as well as assistance with security, unless someone can clarify it otherwise.


Ok, not exactly founded, but supported financially.

And not supported militarly, if I understand Kel'noz correctly, and yet that's exactly what they would need right now.
I guess Ariel and Kel went to Ys without much hope for help, but did it nevertheless. No so much stupidity but rather a lack of alternatives.

For all we know, they went to the Kyorl's colony to get support and came back empty-handed, save for picking a few friends.

Guess they'll have to prove to the world that they're not just a split Sargh faction who, for some reason nobody wants to care, went rogue, but the future for all drowkind.
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Re: Chapter 54 : page 1

Postby Doom Chinchilla » Sat Jan 06, 2018 6:12 pm

Black Knight LeFreux wrote:For all we know, they went to the Kyorl's colony to get support and came back empty-handed, save for picking a few friends.


I think they visited Ys "a few days" before the Kyorl colony. They probably didn't bother visiting the Kyorl colony first because 1.-Anahid isn't there, so they can't commit to Ariel's cause (they would need to ask Anahid first); 2.-I think the Kyorl symbol was among those of alliance members that went to the last gathering in Felde; 3.-Ariel doesn't know Chiri is in the colony, so she doesn't expect to find any friends there...
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Re: Chapter 54 : page 1

Postby Moric » Sat Jan 06, 2018 10:14 pm

Black Knight LeFreux wrote:That's realpolitik, even if it seems madness.

Realpolitik? ...No. Ys is Snadhya'rune's almost as much as Felde.
Black Knight LeFreux wrote:Furthermore, we don't know if every other council member here are really on board with the Felde partnership.

I do. They are alive, therefore properly subservient to Snadhya. QED. Also, notice the sideways glances and smirks of the other council members. The Wolfpack is a joke to them.
Black Knight LeFreux wrote:Not to mention that Ys doesn't seem to have really gotten anything from that deal, besides not being obliterated by Snadhya.

...That's actually a pretty big thing. That said, Ys has been endorsed by Kyo'nne while on Snadhya's payroll. Just saying...
Black Knight LeFreux wrote:"We endured", said Kane'ohe. What are we supposed to understand by that ? My guess is Ys had to defend itself alone, without really any help from Felde and its miracle weapon, which could have wiped a good portion of the goblins army and scared the rest.

Since falling in line with Snadhya and kicking out the Sargs, I doubt that the Herms marched within 10 leagues of Ys. Do I think that the Herms love Snadhya? No, but I think there is a relationship there, involving more than just a big canon.
Black Knight LeFreux wrote:I may not have any proof for that last bit, but we don't have proof either that the airship was used for anything but terror.

I'm pretty sure that we can eventually expect a Daydream episode of Mel and Snadhya on an overworld cruise.
El Bandito wrote:Kel'noz will talk this through. With his huge dong!

Eh....no.

While Kel'noz does have...assets...that are desired by most females:
1. Merged females by Snadhya suggests a closeness to Snadhya that even some full Nids don't have.
2. Considering Snadhya's behavior/backstories, I think that closeness is more than ideological, if you know what I mean.
3. I doubt that merging brings back tactile sensitivity.
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Re: Chapter 54 : page 1

Postby Smokehammer » Sat Jan 06, 2018 11:29 pm

Black Knight LeFreux wrote:Ok, not exactly founded, but supported financially.

Snadhya rarely does anything with just her name on it, but if she’s involved in any way its pretty much “hers”. And it should be seen as more or less the same thing from Ariel’s PoV. Not only did she know Snadhya was the main backing for Ys, Ariel was also shown the door when she fought there to protect it right when Snadhya decided to make an open move for supremacy. She should’ve also been informed by Chrys on her armless ride back from Felde that nearly all of the other colonies besides Ys had been attacked by the airship when it was stolen -heavily implying that Ys was immune because it already belonged to Snadhya. * Yeah, the Sarghress colonies weren’t attacked either, but that was because Snadhya was trying to blame the attacks ON the Sarghress.

We don’t really know the details -its possible that Ys was one of the only places that would trade with Mach all this time but its sure as shit should’ve been seen as a hostile place from what we’ve seen. However, I agree with Doom. It looks like theyre just randomly flying around being polite to see who will help and who wont. (then again maybe they fully intend to attack Ys, and are simply confirming that they need to because that’s the way Ariel rolls). I dont think that qualifies as stupid so much as desperate or naive, but Kane's comments still stand. Unless...unless Ashie's finally going to use her mind control for something besides darker skin. B)

And not supported militarily, if I understand Kel'noz correctly, and yet that's exactly what they would need right now.
I dont think Snadhya's big on military support. Its also entirely possible that Snadhya doesnt have any to give. She isnt exactly unilaterally in power given Ana doesnt like her at all, and Zala's Alliance is just that -an Alliance highly dependent upon its various members cooperation. Other than Zala being unsure of the Sarghress without Quain unifying them, Snadhya arguably has little power at all.

Moric wrote: Since falling in line with Snadhya and kicking out the Sargs, I doubt that the Herms marched within 10 leagues of Ys. Do I think that the Herms love Snadhya? No, but I think there is a relationship there, involving more than just a big canon.
That probably had nothing to do with Snadhya, because if it did Ys wouldve opened up on that airship with said canons already. Also, I hate to say this but Ys does look pretty beat up -I wouldnt be surprised if they are being attacked by the Herms fairly regularly. I mean why else would it even be being mentioned here? Wishful thinking on the Wolf Pack's part?

Dalvyserran wrote:Ys is in a much better position than Ariel's group... why would they rebel against the Empire that now owns Felde (as Zala promised to do), and has been supporting this independent colony with no issue?

Why would they listen to a rebel group that has been blacklisted (and thus cut off from the underworld), and is carrying a ship that is by all rights property of the Empire with Snadhya's "death"?

A lot of you folks forget that readers are all seeing, but characters are not.

Actually, yeah Kyo never mentions Snadhya. So... Maybe they went to Ys because they knew it was Snads, but now that she's dead (as far as they know) they thought there was a chance that the Ysens might change their minds. That actually makes a hell of a lot of sense. *doh*
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Re: Chapter 54 : page 1

Postby Moric » Sun Jan 07, 2018 3:12 am

Smokehammer wrote:
Moric wrote: Since falling in line with Snadhya and kicking out the Sargs, I doubt that the Herms marched within 10 leagues of Ys. Do I think that the Herms love Snadhya? No, but I think there is a relationship there, involving more than just a big canon.
That probably had nothing to do with Snadhya, because if it did Ys wouldve opened up on that airship with said canons already. Also, I hate to say this but Ys does look pretty beat up -I wouldnt be surprised if they are being attacked by the Herms fairly regularly. I mean why else would it even be being mentioned here? Wishful thinking on the Wolf Pack's part?

I didn't mean that Ys has big canons, I meant that Snadhya has probably been dealing with the Herms, albeit through proxies, which may or may not have anything to do with Ys. Also, beat up? Sure, there's an old sword in the dirt a cliff away, but that's it. Well, there is a haze/cloud affect, but I see pretty much a bunch of happy little buildings in the distance. Lastly, wishful? Snadhya'rune manipulating the Hermionne armies is pretty much the opposite of wishful thinking.
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Re: Chapter 54 : page 1

Postby Ardan Styyx » Sun Jan 07, 2018 3:17 am

Well...
Yeah, our heroes might not be aware there is like O chance Ys council would support them, although that lack of insight would be very disapointing from Kel. But, hey, maybe Kane doesn't know either Snad is still alive and has to deal with a less sponsoring Alliance. There might be a (very small and short) window there.
Soooo... Maybe it's time for Kyonne to enter the scene and save the day?... :S
Ok, it doesn't convince me a bit either
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Re: Chapter 54 : page 1

Postby Junglefowl26 » Mon Jan 08, 2018 7:21 pm

Ah, so they weren't going to Chiri specifically so much as making a alliance with other colonies in general.

A colonial congress perhaps. :P

What I find most interesting is that Kane refers this as a coalition of lesser colonies. I was under the impression that Machtike and Ys were among the largest and most important colonies, except perhaps for a few of the older Illhardro colonies.

Makes me wonder just how many colonies are out there in general.

considering Snadhya stole it first that's going to be interesting next time someone take it. It will be a circle of stealing.

I am still kind of disappointed that we didn't get any in-universe commentary on that. You would think that the Illhardro would be pissed about it...and even more pissed about it being used to sack their colony and desperately needed supply convoy.

Sure, they pinned it on the Sarghress at first and that was a good move that worked well, but with Snad flaunting her new toy so much and Naq spies seeing the same Suls both at the riots and Snad's conference, I imagine they worked out the truth eventually.
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Re: Chapter 54 : page 1

Postby Doom Chinchilla » Mon Jan 08, 2018 8:51 pm

*Wrong thread*
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