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Chapter 54 : page 6

Re: Chapter 54 : page 6

Postby Moric » Tue Jan 16, 2018 10:22 pm

Dalvyserran wrote:Having a sword at your back is not being forced to help the people you wanted dead only a few days ago?

Agreed, though whether she would have done so willingly, I don't know. After all, she *volunteered* information regarding the Sarghress legion coming for them. I can see a captured ideologue doing many things, but giving vital information to the enemy without even being asked for it, well, that's not one of them.

Even so, were I Sar'nel, the sword would be right there anyhow.

Saffron Walden wrote:I'm not certain a police state is worse than perpetual warfare, really. Is she forcing everyone to do the taint thing?

A police state can be worse, or not as bad as perpetual warfare. I suppose some things have to be considered. First, how restrictive is the police state? Second, are we talking perpetual wars on the outskirts of town between Vals, leaving the commoners out of the mess like the old days, or fifteen years of bloody urban warfare a mere sixteen years after the last mass slaughter?
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Re: Chapter 54 : page 6

Postby Smokehammer » Wed Jan 17, 2018 12:30 am

Felde's held by the heads of prosperous guilds which are all loyal to Snadhya. They dont fight each other because theyre all unified. She doesnt tolerate petty fighting, poverty or weakness but how restrictive she is to each individual, or how much information she keeps out of paranoia on each person is unknown. The Sharen under Diva were held in a police state (not Chel mind you, just the Sharen) but Im not certain Felde qualifies at all. It probably isnt a great place to live if youre handicapped, or poor or really love brawling but its unknown as to whether or not Snad carries out Diva's level of assholism towards her city that she suffered under in her Clan. Im guessing a resounding no, because Snadhya has an ego the size of Jupiter and she hated growing up like that, and considers it one of Diva's character faults. Plus she isnt big on terror or military might and you get a nice strong vibe that Snadhya doesnt give a shit what anyone thinks as long as they do what she expects them to. So while you cant argue with Felde's leadership and expect to be listened to, and you cant change its direction from whatever Snadhya thinks is awesome (without changing her mind) it probably isnt "beyond the pale" restrictive to people used to dealing with the Clan system or monarchies like Nuqra.

That being said, somehow violence is infinitely preferable to manipulation as a method for solving issues with douchebags. Ergo, Snadhya as "High Queen" of the Elves will suck ass -evil or not.
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Re: Chapter 54 : page 6

Postby Junglefowl26 » Wed Jan 17, 2018 4:52 am

Moric wrote:1. I think that the negotiations were offered in earnest, though with foreknowledge of a zero chance of success. Kyo'nne might even know of the Snadhya'rune altar.

2. That said, the negotiations do get all the leaders in one room. Sound tactics there.

3. Empath invisibility reminds me of Vampire the Masquerade discipline of Obfuscation. You aren't invisible, just unnoticeable.

1. Yeah, that seems fair

2. In the short run. If word gets out, I think it would make other colonies be less willing to meet with her, or worse, turn the tables and ambush her next time.

3. Neat.

Saffron Walden wrote:I haven't read this in a long time.

Can someone remind me what, other than the way she's obtained power, Snadhya's actually doing in her area of control that makes her evil? Is it something with auras and demons? Is it just her enforcement of the aristocracy against the sarghress' rather nebulous meritocracy? Is Ariel just fighting her out of patriotism?

Well, the way she has obtained power is a pretty big deal - when someone has a long history of backstabing any allies that aren't her personal stooges, inflicting widescale massacres, and attacking even people who are neutral and not much of a threat (see the Beld chapter)...well, peaceful coexistance doesn't seem like much of an option.

Now as to why Ariel is personally fighting Snad - well, Snad did just attack Ariel's colony in chapter 52. Generally speaking, it is common for people who have been attack to counter-attack and try to defeat their foe, regardless of the attacker's domestic policies.

More importantly - the ship didn't just attack and leave, or attack and demand surrender - it spent days deliberately hunting down a handful of survivors in order to utterly exterminate the colony. They put a lot of effort into it. And even after all of that is over she gets a message that an entire legion is being sent to finish the job.

Simply put, at this point this is no longer a political conflict, but a fight for survival.

As for why Ariel rejected the initial offer that led to the airship attack, it was a combination of factors that made her mistrust Snad. What happened last time she went to Felde, the airship's timing with its arrival, the high number of troops on board, the fact that the Herms had a very fancy cannon despite never having used gunpowder weapons before, Kyo acting all nervous and suspicious etc.

Though to turn back to Snad's rule - we don't spend a lot of time in Felde (and that is focused on a conference in a fancy hotel basically) and even less on Ys (almost entirely focused on our Sarghress tourists) so it is hard to say for sure.

However, what do have is the Felde history page, which ends on a very ominious image of a poor person hiding while the Sul trio walks by and the lines about how poverty is not permitted in the city...
We also have the Felde audiobook, where a drow expresses disgust with the city, describing how native Feldians live as second class cities while the city becomes a playground for rich Chelians - and I would bet most of this rich Chelians would be Nids or other Snad allies.
Oh, and it is worth noting that Snad talked about "recycling" servants for not doing their servant jobs when the city was under attack. And that the Feldian guards seem used to the idea of their superiors killing them in tantrums (Ariel tossing the guard into the water, the guards talking about how dangerous it was to talk to Snad when she is angry, those same guards running from Khaless...)

So the general impression I get is of a rule Snad's chosen can do what they like and the common people have little wealth or recourse, and possibly with empathetic thought police snatching up anyone who feels angry about the situation.
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Re: Chapter 54 : page 6

Postby Moric » Wed Jan 17, 2018 1:05 pm

2. Yes, that tactic does have serious drawbacks. I suppose that if it is to be used at all, it would be best to use it on the biggest, toughest target, then use the airship's speed to outpace the inevitable word of mouth. After all, the Councillors will likely have to huff it back to Felde before they can broadcast Wolfpack activities.
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Re: Chapter 54 : page 6

Postby PSadlon » Wed Jan 17, 2018 7:57 pm

I'm just saying she probably needs less convincing than she needs a few days ago and more so over working with Ash than anyone else. She is not stupid and understands the position she is in all too well. She comes across as mercenary in most aspects outside of her vendetta with Ash. If anything that means you can generally trust them to keep her best interests in mind on anything but Ash.
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Re: Chapter 54 : page 6

Postby Saffron Walden » Fri Jan 19, 2018 5:35 pm

Basically, the way I see it is when she was out of power, Snadhyarune was bad because she was causing instability and violence. Now, other than some sort of conflict with the owl coslplayers, she is the stability and unless the tainting thing is still common policy and not just a tactic she used before taking over, I think rebelling against her is probably pointless. I seriously doubt that a bunch of militarists like sarghress are going to run the various places better, unless there still is some sort of general taint thing being enforced on everyone (important) in the underground.
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Re: Chapter 54 : page 6

Postby Saffron Walden » Sat Jan 20, 2018 5:48 am

(Of course, Ariel ought still fight her for personal reasons such as avenging various people's deaths.)
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Re: Chapter 54 : page 6

Postby Moric » Sat Jan 20, 2018 11:51 am

Saffron Walden wrote:Basically, the way I see it is when she was out of power, Snadhyarune was bad because she was causing instability and violence. Now, other than some sort of conflict with the owl coslplayers, she is the stability and unless the tainting thing is still common policy and not just a tactic she used before taking over, I think rebelling against her is probably pointless. I seriously doubt that a bunch of militarists like sarghress are going to run the various places better, unless there still is some sort of general taint thing being enforced on everyone (important) in the underground.

Snadhya'rune doesn't just want power. She wants ALL the power. She has every intention of killing off each and every clan, leaving her as a solitary totalitarian autocrat of the world. She will be answerable to nobody and fear nobody. She will rule with an iron fist, and there will be nothing that anyone can do but submit, no matter how poorly they are treated.

At that point, even some mouth-breathing goons like the Sarghress are a better future.
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